0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Ouch! Oh, wow. I just read what you have stated about your involvement with the recipients, their case-workers, and the lady who runs the show. I now have the picture firmly envisioned. 1) You load an older, low powered laptop with Linux, deliver it to some lady, then walk away. 2) The "lady who runs the show" is only "vaguely familiar with" Linux of any flavor. 3) Case workers who probably know nothing about Linux and even less about Linux Lite then distribute the laptops directly to the recipients. Regardless of what I have said before, and might say after, this is a losing battle. Who do you expect to answer questions about Linux? Who is to provide instruction or advice? It seems you really do think these poor kids should just sit down at a PC and intuitively know everything they need to know to use the device. It's not going to happen, Derek. If I'm the first to say it to you, I'm sorry. If other members of this forum think I'm wrong and these kids are going to be sharp enough and bright enough to learn Linux from scratch, by themselves, I'm sure those members will chastise me and voice their opinions.As to the "Software Center" and it's limited choices of software, unless changes have been made to Windows in the past ten plus years, where is there a "Software Center" or application similar to Synaptic to view and install software? Did Microsoft suddenly decide to provide a means to effortlessly install the "billions" of apps available for each and every version of Windows currently supported? How did they get around the proprietary software agreements? Are they allowing Windows users to install Microsoft Office for free on every Windows PC? You are asking Linux, and specifically Lite to offer every piece of software available in a simple, easy to use, software installer. If you want tens of thousands of free choices, learn Synaptic. Using only the default repositories you have literally tens of thousands of FREE software choices. How many similar choices are available for FREE for Windows? Shareware? Understand what shareware is and what is actually supposed to occur - PAYMENT for use. And what you may not be aware of is that you are completely free to add additional repositories to Synaptic. I'm not sure how many, but I have 5 or 6 additional added at the present time. Synaptic (or other means of updating) then updates not only the software choice, but every dependency that choice requires - effortlessly and without even having to think about it.I'll also cover updating here briefly. You stated in another thread your displeasure with how "Lite Updates" worked. I suggested you "try looking into the tweaked Mint Update Manager that Ralphy has provided us". I'm guessing you haven't searched for, nor researched for your use, the tweaked update manager. I have to believe if you had, you would most certainly have posted some reply about how nice it will be to provide such a simple and easy to use update method for your laptop recipients.Please don't expect ANY version of Linux, or any other OS, to be a "one size fits all", do everything for you, operating system. Those don't (and have never) exist. That includes PC-DOS/MS-DOS 1.0. Life, and computers, just don't work that way. Sorry.
@Derek_ wrote: But people are used to mobile phones with a billion apps, and WinMac with a billion apps so i don't know.You're right. You don't know. You're comparing apples and oranges. Apps as you refer to them here are not system files. Most of those billions are java and web language abstractions. Applications in synaptic and in so-called software centers include binaries and binary dependencies that integrate into your system. Also I-phones, Android phones, Apple Macs, and Windows 10 are all built on much older system kernels and binaries than Ubuntu. Linux software uses abstraction layers of java in applications like LibreOffice but most of those billions of apps you refer to are a patchwork quilt of useless code (often 32bit) too OLD to run efficiently and securely on newer Linux systems. When it comes to "apps" as you refer to them "new" in the Windows/Mac/Android world is very often not new. Maybe somebody built it just yesterday, and wow it still works on Windows 10, but it's code base is too old for Ubuntu. Also anyone who thinks synaptic package manager is too complex shouldn't go near the CLI of a modern Linux system. Also the main problem with "software centers" the way you mean them is that they are resource hogs in GUI mode. I used to hate KDE's, and I wish it was never added into Ubuntu. A lot of applications in them are not included in the initial install of whatever base system they're on because they a often LESS efficient alternatives. The same can be said of Debian's synaptic as well, but Debian users think that way normally: understand that those 50.000 applications are not there because they're new; and most of what's new in already in the OS.TC
I can use Synaptic. But new users, trying to come across from Windows (which i thought was part of the appeal) do struggle with it. It's heavy on initial information and daunting. I chose Lite for charity because i thought it would make it easier for people with little IT experience, or whose only experience would be WinMac.
The recipients of these devices vary. Some may be excited about using and learning Linux. Many (most, just like everyone else) just wants to get stuff done. I don't deal directly with these people, i supply these machines for their case-workers to give them. I'm lucky the lady who runs the show was vaguely familiar with Linux and was receptive. Most charities i approached weren't interested: it's not WinMac What i may be erroneously thinking is that people will get Linux Lite and go "i can only install these 20 programs?". Wipe it, and put Windows on it. This isn't my problem, but i love Linux and want people to know about it and use it (oh, and usually the hardware really can't copy with Windows 10). Its also possible that the limited choice that covers most app types is ok; that a more comprehensive range will just confuse people. But people are used to mobile phones with a billion apps, and WinMac with a billion apps so i don't know.What drew me to LL was the online FAQ/help that covered some common errors and stuff, and i remember a useful error message that actually told the person how to fix it (for memory by linking to the FAQ). TBH i didn't even notice the sparsity of the Lite Software selection until i had trouble installing something via the Terminal and thought i'd see if it was in the 'software centre'.I've only recently switched to Linux Lite for these peeps and i'm yet to get feedback. Depending on what they say, it may be the case that Linux Lite just isn't quite what i was looking for and i should continue to trial alternatives. I'll wait and see what happens with the recent batch before i do more.
First, if you find Synaptic to be too difficult to learn to use, you might consider not attempting to install any software that isn't either installed by default with the version of Lite you have chosen, or is not available in the Lite Software list. Synaptic is one of the most user friendly and intuitive means of installing new software, removing software, updating installed packages, fixing broken packages, and doing upgrades. If you find Synaptic too difficult to learn and use, you might very well be overstepping your current limits.As has been stated by Jerry and others on this forum, Lite's mission is NOT to provide every user with every piece of software available in the free market. It's mission and intent is to provide a very simple to use and easy to understand alternative to the Windows operating system. Once a person has become familiar with using Lite, hopefully they will continue to use it and learn to install the software they would prefer, either via Synaptic, GDebi Package Installer, Tarballs, or other means. The one thing each of those people needs to remember is that Jerry and the guys offer no support for such attempts. If they "bork" their install, it's a lesson learned. That''s not entirely a bad thing. Over the years I have learned many lessons from such failed attempts.
I guess in short what I'm saying here is that just maybe you need to consider learning more about Linux and how to install software. I seem to recall in another of your threads you made a comment about doing things from the command line. If you're familiar with command line use, why the need for a completely basic, easy to use, software installer? Do the things you need from the command line. If your request is actually for the recipients of the PCs your are giving away, let those recipients learn to use a basic Linux install before you offer them a way to install every piece of software Linux has to offer. I would even go so far as to remove the Menu listing for the Lite Software list. Users just new to Linux probably shouldn't be given a means to install, uninstall, change, tweak, fiddle, and fart with their new PC.Just my 2 cents worth.
Unfortunately, it's not that simple to use Synaptic, compared to the various 'software centres' around, its the antithesis of simple.I don't understand the reasons for the lack of a simple software centre akin to something like Mint's or Deepin's. Having one doesn't in any way diminish the mission. I can only assume its not an easy thing to accomplish/maintain and there aren't the resources for it, which is a perfectly valid reason.