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CPUs & Graphics cards: suitability for LL

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CPUs & Graphics cards: suitability for LL
« on: February 11, 2019, 06:59:56 AM »
 

m654321

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In the wake of the mysterious early death of my gaming laptop (Asus G750JS), after 3 years and 10 months, I'm considering replacing it with a new, more robust system to run with LL. It was an i7-HQ4710 machine with dual graphics (Intel HD 4600 & nVidia GTX870).

It would seem that a PC Tower wins over a Laptop for cost, better cooling, and flexibility for upgrading, but loses out on its greater power consumption, and lack of portability. Of course no system is perfect, and inevitably there will be some element of compromise. The other consideration is what CPU and graphics card am I going to choose for the replacement system, given that it will be used for occasional gaming (e.g. Supertuxkart, Roblox)?

Processors
Intel CPUs appear to run cooler at faster speeds, though are more expensive than say AMD ones. As well as the greater cost, they seem to come with some other issues, e.g. the complication of UEFI, as well as the Spectre & Meltdown issues (though these now seem to be patched).  Given this, would AMD, or other processor brands, be potentially more trouble-free with LL?

Graphics Cards
I've read around that nVidia, in general, doesn't play very well with Linux, and Linus Torvald appears to have strong views on the subject! That said, I've found that nVidia does appear to give very good quality graphics, where Intel graphics may struggle or not work at all. However, there are other choices out there, e.g. AMD graphics - Radeon cards seem very popular but do they work well with Linux, and more specifically with LL.

Hardware Database for LL
To help make an informed decision about a CPU/Graphics setup, I browsed the LL hardware database at https://www.linuxliteos.com/hardware.php  The only snag with these data is that no personal comment is given, by the user, as to how well the CPU/Graphics hardware worked with LL. For example, a while ago, I installed the LL3 series on a Samsung NP-N145 Plus netbook with an Intel Atom N455@1.66GHz CPU (2 threads), uploaded the data to the hardware database, but later had to abandon LL3 on that netbook, as it lagged significantly.

I'm in no rush to go out and buy a replacement system (quite happy to wait a year) as, given how much these things cost & being a bit tight generally, I want to make an informed decision for something that will last. Any feedback much appreciated as ever ...  8)

Cheers
Mike
Last Edit: February 12, 2019, 10:00:47 AM by m654321
Linux user since 2014. Below: 64bit OS installed in Legacy mode on MBR (msdos/ext4) formatted SSDs, except the pi which uses a micro SDHC card:
2017 - Raspberry pi 3B (4cores) ~ Arm710@1.2GHz - LibreElec, used for upgrading our Samsung TV (excellent for the task)  
2012 - Lenovo G580 2689 (2cores; 4threads] ~ i3-3110M - LL3.8/Win8.1 dual-boot (LL working smoothly)
2011 - Samsung NP-N145 Plus (1core; 2threads) ~ Intel Atom N455@1.66GHz - Manjaro (tried LL3 series but lagged)
2008 - Asus X71Q (2cores) ~ Intel T3200@2.0GHz - LL4.4/Win8.1 dual-boot (LL working beautifully)
2007 - Dell Latitude D630 (2cores) ~ Intel T7100@1.8GHz - LL3.8/Win8.1 dual-boot (LL really zippy!) - my daily driver  :-)
 


Re: CPUs & Graphics cards: suitability for LL
« Reply #1 on: February 11, 2019, 08:21:45 AM »
 

TheDead

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Hello,

I have tried the new Ryzen familly from AMD only once and for a really short time. Seems a good product line.
But from the "older" dozens of PCs I installed Linux Lite on for low-income families, the only problems I had with nVidia was with really old video cards.
With ATI/AMD video cards on the other hand, I had to twink and tweak quite a few times to have them work correctly and sometimes jusr got tired and took the "easy way" and changed to an nVidia card. ;)

Didn't have any troubles with AMD CPU though but I'm guessing new chipsets have some development time to get the main bugs outs the fews first kernel compiles.

Hope this helps a little! ;)

Cheers!
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Re: CPUs & Graphics cards: suitability for LL
« Reply #2 on: February 11, 2019, 06:26:29 PM »
 

bitsnpcs

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I'm in no rush to go out and buy a replacement system (quite happy to wait a year) as, given how much these things cost & being a bit tight generally, I want to make an informed decision for something that will last. Any feedback much appreciated as ever ...  8)

Cheers
Mike

gamers demand i9 apparently -  https://www.punchtechnology.co.uk/gaming/
Last Edit: February 13, 2019, 01:24:24 PM by bitsnpcs
 

Re: CPUs & Graphics cards: suitability for LL
« Reply #3 on: February 11, 2019, 07:01:03 PM »
 

Jerry

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Don't forget to take a live USB of LL when you go shopping!

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Re: CPUs & Graphics cards: suitability for LL
« Reply #4 on: February 12, 2019, 08:01:53 AM »
 

TheDead

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Don't forget to take a live USB of LL when you go shopping!

Lol, I have two USB keys on me most of the time... guess what one of them has on it! ;)
I did quite a few "demos" with it too... Thinking about it,  now I feel like a Linux "Ambassador", maybe I should carry a badge or something, lol!

Cheers!
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Re: CPUs & Graphics cards: suitability for LL
« Reply #5 on: February 12, 2019, 08:16:32 AM »
 

DeepThought

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@TheDead  something like this lol :)

Code: [Select]
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Linux-Penguin-pin-badge-Cartoon-penguin-Nice-badge-Sealife-Bulk-option-/312059577009
Or extra options

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https://www.zazzle.com/linux+buttons
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Re: CPUs & Graphics cards: suitability for LL
« Reply #6 on: February 12, 2019, 08:41:32 AM »
 

TheDead

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Nice, but I was thinking more like a golden "Linux Police" badge in a nice leather thingy.

Oooo, seems like somebody had a similar idea ! :

Cheers!
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Re: CPUs & Graphics cards: suitability for LL
« Reply #7 on: February 12, 2019, 09:47:43 AM »
 

m654321

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Don't forget to take a live USB of LL when you go shopping!
Yes I might try that  :) 
Won't the shop assistant raise a quizzical eyebrow, in response to "do you mind if I run LL in the live environment off your demo machine in the shop window"?

LOL@TheDead
LOL@DeepThought

@bitsnpcs
Quote
gamers demand i9 apparently
I'd love that, but I'm afraid it's a bit outside of my price bracket! Something like an i5, or an AMD equivalent (whatever that would be), would be closer to home. Anyway my gaming needs are pretty modest, the ocassional burst of Supertuxkart for me, and Roblox for my young daughter

Many thanks for the link though - looks useful & reasonably priced for custom made machines 8)
Last Edit: February 12, 2019, 11:27:50 AM by m654321
Linux user since 2014. Below: 64bit OS installed in Legacy mode on MBR (msdos/ext4) formatted SSDs, except the pi which uses a micro SDHC card:
2017 - Raspberry pi 3B (4cores) ~ Arm710@1.2GHz - LibreElec, used for upgrading our Samsung TV (excellent for the task)  
2012 - Lenovo G580 2689 (2cores; 4threads] ~ i3-3110M - LL3.8/Win8.1 dual-boot (LL working smoothly)
2011 - Samsung NP-N145 Plus (1core; 2threads) ~ Intel Atom N455@1.66GHz - Manjaro (tried LL3 series but lagged)
2008 - Asus X71Q (2cores) ~ Intel T3200@2.0GHz - LL4.4/Win8.1 dual-boot (LL working beautifully)
2007 - Dell Latitude D630 (2cores) ~ Intel T7100@1.8GHz - LL3.8/Win8.1 dual-boot (LL really zippy!) - my daily driver  :-)
 

Re: CPUs & Graphics cards: suitability for LL
« Reply #8 on: February 12, 2019, 04:08:04 PM »
 

bitsnpcs

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@m654321 they have that too
Last Edit: February 13, 2019, 06:21:13 PM by bitsnpcs
 

Re: CPUs & Graphics cards: suitability for LL
« Reply #9 on: February 13, 2019, 08:05:20 AM »
 

TheDead

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Heya!

Following on bitsnpcs comment...
I don't know if this is still the case but when I shopped my PC a few years ago (gen 2xxx and 3xxx Intel CPUs), the most bang for the buck was i5.
i5 was even faster in lots of benchmarks then i7. Main reason was that i5 had higher clock speeds, so, even if i7 had more cores, most games didn't use them.
Not to mention i5 was a lot cheaper. I suggest you look at some of your "probable" games benchmarks, you could save a lot of bucks and would affect speed.
i3 was not worth mentionning, it's cheaper but would not consider it a "gaming" CPU.

You can start to flame me now if I'm mistaken. I'm not has inclined to modify, add cool lights and tweak everything regarding my PCs as I used too so I guess I could be called a Gamer Geezer or something. ;)

Cheers!
Note : I modified my post since it came to my attention that I used an inapropriate word. I'm truly sorry and apologized to anyone offended and can sincerely assure you that it was not done to voluntarily disrespect anyone.
Last Edit: February 15, 2019, 08:24:52 AM by torreydale
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Re: CPUs & Graphics cards: suitability for LL
« Reply #10 on: February 13, 2019, 01:14:28 PM »
 

bitsnpcs

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.
Last Edit: February 15, 2019, 06:37:18 AM by bitsnpcs
 

Re: CPUs & Graphics cards: suitability for LL
« Reply #11 on: February 14, 2019, 09:24:26 AM »
 

TheDead

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Hi,

I shopped around and seems like the Rizen familly (R5) for equivalent "range" of CPU Versus Intel's (i5) are faster for heavy workload and almost on par for regular stuff.
Seems to be also a little cheaper as a platform. I think I'll go back AMD on my next PC. It's been awhile AMD, more than a decade, glad you're back! ;)

Cheers!
... and I'm sorry again for my earlier and quite stupid/uneducated post... I modified it. :-S
Last Edit: February 14, 2019, 09:26:34 AM by TheDead
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Re: CPUs & Graphics cards: suitability for LL
« Reply #12 on: February 15, 2019, 03:09:54 AM »
 

m654321

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seems like the Rizen familly (R5) for equivalent "range" of CPU Versus Intel's (i5) are faster for heavy workload and almost on par for regular stuff

That's useful to know - many thanks.
I'm now looking at energy consumption - though either an R5 or i5 setup might be suitable, it has to be one that's going to be low on energy consumption, when idling or not playing games.  I notice the Intel chips have a big difference between the 'baseline' and 'turbo' e.g say 2.4 & 3.8 GHz, but Rizen chips have less difference. I guess this means AMD chips are more energy hungry, which is what I've heard.

Though my dead Asus G750JS was rated at 2.4/3.5GHz, the Htop app showed it would idle at significantly less than 1GHz, thereby saving energy when not busy.  Do Rizen, or AMD chips in general, tick over at a low speeds when idling, or doing simple admin tasks, or do they just run faster most of the time, irrespective of the load? 
Linux user since 2014. Below: 64bit OS installed in Legacy mode on MBR (msdos/ext4) formatted SSDs, except the pi which uses a micro SDHC card:
2017 - Raspberry pi 3B (4cores) ~ Arm710@1.2GHz - LibreElec, used for upgrading our Samsung TV (excellent for the task)  
2012 - Lenovo G580 2689 (2cores; 4threads] ~ i3-3110M - LL3.8/Win8.1 dual-boot (LL working smoothly)
2011 - Samsung NP-N145 Plus (1core; 2threads) ~ Intel Atom N455@1.66GHz - Manjaro (tried LL3 series but lagged)
2008 - Asus X71Q (2cores) ~ Intel T3200@2.0GHz - LL4.4/Win8.1 dual-boot (LL working beautifully)
2007 - Dell Latitude D630 (2cores) ~ Intel T7100@1.8GHz - LL3.8/Win8.1 dual-boot (LL really zippy!) - my daily driver  :-)
 

Re: CPUs & Graphics cards: suitability for LL
« Reply #13 on: February 15, 2019, 08:05:27 AM »
 

TheDead

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Do Rizen, or AMD chips in general, tick over at a low speeds when idling, or doing simple admin tasks, or do they just run faster most of the time, irrespective of the load? 

When idling seems newer CPUs are quite similar, +-5W or so. But, when using Multithreading on more heavy tasks, yep, AMD is a power-monger.Read a few articles and this link shows what seems to be the general concensus, in a nice little graph ;) :
https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Processors/Ryzen-7-2700X-and-Ryzen-5-2600X-Review-Zen-Matures/Power-Consumption-Overclocki-0Note : Depending on platform, motherboard and different integrated components power consumption can vary, sometimes significantly.

Cheers!
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Re: CPUs & Graphics cards: suitability for LL
« Reply #14 on: February 16, 2019, 12:11:19 AM »
 

m654321

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this link shows what seems to be the general concensus, in a nice little graph ;) :
https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Processors/Ryzen-7-2700X-and-Ryzen-5-2600X-Review-Zen-Matures/Power-Consumption-Overclocki-0
Many thanks for this link - some very useful comparisons between AMD Ryzen & Intel Core i CPUs.
It confirms that while idling there's hardly any difference between the two CPU types, but once a
load is applied, the Intel chips use significantly less energy. So maybe, regardless of the drawbacks
of Intel chips (UEFI, spectre, meltdown, etc) this might be the choice to save on energy bills and
save the planet.

In the same vein, I came across an interesting statistic recently:
2% of the world's PCs are apparently used for gaming, but these consume 20% of global computing power ...  :o
Last Edit: February 16, 2019, 12:29:28 AM by m654321
Linux user since 2014. Below: 64bit OS installed in Legacy mode on MBR (msdos/ext4) formatted SSDs, except the pi which uses a micro SDHC card:
2017 - Raspberry pi 3B (4cores) ~ Arm710@1.2GHz - LibreElec, used for upgrading our Samsung TV (excellent for the task)  
2012 - Lenovo G580 2689 (2cores; 4threads] ~ i3-3110M - LL3.8/Win8.1 dual-boot (LL working smoothly)
2011 - Samsung NP-N145 Plus (1core; 2threads) ~ Intel Atom N455@1.66GHz - Manjaro (tried LL3 series but lagged)
2008 - Asus X71Q (2cores) ~ Intel T3200@2.0GHz - LL4.4/Win8.1 dual-boot (LL working beautifully)
2007 - Dell Latitude D630 (2cores) ~ Intel T7100@1.8GHz - LL3.8/Win8.1 dual-boot (LL really zippy!) - my daily driver  :-)
 


 


Linux Lite 4.6 RC1 has been released. See the Release Announcements section for more information.